Saturday, July 2, 2016

My Final Titebond 3 Test



After reading Dave Zeiger's method of saturating the cloth I decided to try something similar.  I put a layer of 10 oz cloth on the plywood and wet it with water.  I then blotted the excess with some paper towel and then painted on the Titebond 3 until the weave was filled.  I let it dry and cure for a few days.

The result was a bond that made it impossible to tear away the fabric.  It was thoroughly bonded to the plywood.

But I still had a concern.  On the boat building forums, the detractors of Titebond 3 argued that it would not stick to it's cured self.  This concerned me because it suggested that I must to everything all at the same time so that I was always working with wet and uncured Titebond 3.

So yesterday I did another little test.  Using the same method described above I laminated another piece of glass over the first.  I left a pull tab on the corner.  I stuck it in my food dehydrator for few hours to speed up the cure.

This morning I tried to tear off the sample and couldn't.  I am 100% confident in this product now for bedding fiberglass on decks and superstructure.

14 comments:

  1. you might be interrested in this.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d2Il5tyYLVk

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. That's the first I've seen of that Everitt... thanks for posting it!

      Delete
    2. You're welcome.
      You've got me to thinking about sails, masts, and everything involved. Ease of use and safety.
      Something else you might look check out is the Ljungstrom sail rig. There is precious little about it on the internet that I've found.
      Sadly wikepedia is the most informative.

      Delete
  2. Al,

    Thanks for two more great tests!

    "I only believe in science"

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mSy1NQx2bJE

    Yoda

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Thanks Yoda...this is one that I'm really happy with.

      Delete
  3. Before it slips my mind ...

    1. What is your plan for layers on the deck, starting from plain wood ... Is it going to be cloth, water, TBIII and then stop? Or that combination twice (one on top of the other)? Or one of those followed by a final coat of TBIII or paint?

    2. Was the TBIII full strength or diluted?

    3. My inner scientist had an unfortunate afterthought. Your second test was not quite as valid as I had first hoped. No way your boat will fit in the food dehydrator.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I'm only using one layer of cloth. So I will lay on the cloth, wet a section, blot it, roll or paint on full strength Titebond 3 to fill the weave, and then move on. I did the test to be sure that if I had to stop for any reason that the transition where I picked up again would be bonded well.

      Delete
    2. So, if I understand you correctly, you don't plan to paint the deck (over the TBIII). That got me to wondering about UV protection. And that got me to wondering about whether a substance that is designed to exist between two pieces of wood, in the dark, would have been tested for UV resistance. Actually makes no sense to have done so as they didn't design it to be an exposed epoxy substitute. If UV test results exist, I can't find info on that, to include at www.titebond.com.

      Delete
    3. Sorry Yoda, I wasn't clear. Yes, paint will go on afterwards. Either a textured deck coating or acrylic with some silica in it for slip prevention. And it will be a light colour.

      Delete
    4. OK, I see. Thanks for explaining. $25 for a 50-lbs bag of silica at Home Depot ain't much, but somewhere in my Internet hiking I ran across a description of a guy using beach sand for the same purpose, to good effect. Added bonus is that it gives you an excuse to go screw off at the beach for awhile. :)

      Delete
  4. These are the tests that move backyard boatbuilding radically ahead. I wonder how the deck would hold up to a blistering day in the tropical sun? Probably excellent for your latitudes.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. I'm thinking it would be fine in the sun especially if protected with a light colour paint. How hot do you think a white deck gets in the tropics? I could bake my sample for another test if you could suggest a temperature...

      Delete
  5. Sooner or later Dave, or someone else, is going to get around to putting out a construction guide for trilos. It's about time we had the next generation of a book like "Buehlers Backyard Boatbuilding" which incorporates a lot of new ways to address older issues like deck covering, etc.. Stuff like Chris Morejohns pretty straightforward (and economical and tough as nails) fiberglass bottom treatment, scantlings for pipe masts, a chapter on construction of little wood stoves (like your way cool one you published a how-to about), etc.. Intriguing evidence that slight rocker in the bottom might make barges sail even better with testing needed there too. I'd imagine a tropical builder will test you and Daves titebond decks sooner or later. You're probably right about the SPF covering doing the trick. Hard to say in the tropical blast furnace though: one reason I'd shy away from a boat that used no epoxy and counted on just 5200 for hull joins since it would probably be rubbery in the heat and move a lot. But way neat that all this data is accumalating.

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Sorry I missed this post until now. One thing about epoxy is that it will soften with heat. That is why most composite aircraft are painted white and are hangared. I'm starting to get the feeling that epoxy is not the be all and the end all. I think that in the grand scheme of things we'll see PL Premium, Titebond 3, black polyurethane caulking, roofing tar and acrylic exterior paint continue to gain acceptance and respect. But as you say, Robert, people willing to do the testing and then document and publish the results will provide the real credibility rather than the voiced opinions of those repeating other voiced opinions.

      You mention the advantage (perceived) of some rocker as opposed to a flat bottom. I'm sure there is but by how much? Simple it is to make some models and drag them with a fishing rod while walking the edge of a pond. How much does the rod bend? More sophistication could be added to the testing; perhaps riding an electric scooter at a fixed speed while holding the rod, and using a spring scale to measure the force. All doable, and of genuine interest to someone considering building a barge - especially compared to the opinions and prejudices of those - who as I just said - repeat the opinions and prejudices of others.

      Delete